'Hire America' is the wrong policy for struggling banks

People like you Zac are why this country is in such a economic mess.Shipping of good paying jobs off shore and then wondering why the unemployment rate is so high and peoples real wages havent gone up in eight years.There are many qualified people in this country who are able to do these jobs.Maybe they should outsource the CEO`s and Board of Directors jobs because obovously the people in those positions are inept.

I disagree with your Hire America comments. I beleive that we should hire American citizens first. In fact we should go futher and tax the hell on all imports to stimulate our ecomomy.

When the American taxpayer is bailing out these companies, they should not be allowed to lay off Americans and hire foreigners.

When we hire these foreigners we lose the ability to tax their income and keep the dollars on U.S. shores.

Sorry Zac, but you're wrong on this one.

Since when does being a foreigner make you more qualified or a harder worker? I am an American and I am not an Upper Crust finance major and I lost my job in banking. The only reason these foreign workers are more efficient is because they can be paid less than an American and if they complain well they can get deported since they need a job to stay here.

I completely support the hire American policy. Americans are are not less smart or hard working than anyone else. In fact I find your suggestion offensive, both to Americans who you are basically calling lazy. You are also reinforcing the stereotype that Asians/Indians are all smart good hard workers. A positive stereotype but a stereotype none the less. I have worked with many foreigners and they have no super powers that Americans don't have. I wonder why people like you seem to believe that Americans are not hard workers. New York is not the financial capital of the world because of foreign workers.

So what are you suggesting? Americans no longer need jobs? Maybe we should just bring in millions of Chinese and Indian workers into every industry so that "Lazy Americans" can be fired and replaced with "Smart, Harder working" foreigners working in this country. What other country in the world has such little regard for its own citizens?

You say American tax payers are getting ripped off, I am an American taxpayer, are Upper crust finance majors not American taxpayers? If my tax dollars are going to help the banks I expect my government to help out it's citizens who want to work in the financial sector. If these banks do not want to abide by the "hire American" policy then don't take the government aid. The government is in place to assist American citizens, when the Chinese government decides to help me at the expense of their own Chinese citizens then maybe I will revisit my position.

I pray that you lose your source of income and are replaced by a cheaper harder working, more literate foreign worker.

Wrong Policy Leading to Non-Impact

"Hire American" is nice populism, good patriotism but doesn't do a thing for an average unemployed American citizen. This is why:

1. The banks that took TARP money are financial institutions.
2. If financial institutions were to hire, they will be hiring for their needs in the financial sector, not marketing jobs that require an undergrad degree or in the technology sector (for tech sector their approach is different). In other words they won't displace Americans that are alredy in such jobs.
3. Jobs in the financial sector typically need MBA for someone to be hired on a H-1B visa.
4. If you have an H-1B you won't be competing on salary or wage basis--if the native is offered a lesser wage and if he/she founds that wage to be better than the alternative (sitting at home with a $100K loan), they will jump and take up the offer. In other words, as they say in Economics, the marginal decision is to make $5K-$7.5K less -- not a dichotomous situation of Job or No Job. That's where the entire argument is lost on idiots (read: Lou Dobbs) who argue otherwise.

What about technology sector jobs?
1. The issue here is very different: Banks that took TARP money are NOT prevented from outsourcing their work or contracting with any firm that works on technology sector or contracting with firms that are H-1B dependent (ie., immigrant sweat shops).
2. Ceteris paribas, If the choice for a financial firm is between hiring a native tech worker v. an immigrant tech worker then the answer is clear: hire the native because the immigrant is bringing in an added cost of processing the visa, money and time lags.
3. Ceteris paribas, If the choice for a firm is to decide whether to outsource the work or not, the choice is clear: ship the jobs offshore and save $$.

This idea of placing a bar on hiring folks who have obtained a degree in America (immigrant or not, you still have a $100K loan on your head) is sheer bone-headed populism that doesn't do a thing for an average unemployed American citizen. Wal-Mart didn't make it to lowest prices by locating all its production in Topkea, Kansas alone, but because it sought out low cost production with concomittant quality where it was.

Chuck Grassley and Bernie Sanders are populists, panderers and socialists - not economically rational and thoughtful policy makers.

Nat, simply put you don't know what you are talking about. Citigroup alone has laid off well over 50,000 workers, mostly Americans. The economic impact of these losses on the New York economy has been monumental, and has led to thousands of other job losses in sectors that depend on these bankers as clientele, restaurants, real estate, tourism etc etc have all suffered and people have lost their jobs.

This has nothing at all whatsoever to do with Tech jobs because TARP did not supply any money to Tech companies. The issue is, should a government supported bank be allowed to take actions that do not support the very people who gave them this financial support. We are not talking about all private institutions who can hire anyone they want we are talking about firms that took TARP money. Tech companies can hire all the H-1B workers they can get their hands on but as soon as they take government money, if they ever do, then I will say hire Americans too.

I don't know which banks you have worked at and I doubt you have worked at any but you don't have to have an MBA at all to be hired as an H-1b, I know because I worked with many who didn't. You are obviously commenting from a position of ignorance.

You 4th point is simply nonsense. The economic theory you site requires all parties have equal knowledge, in the case of salaries workers do not know what others are making when they apply for a position. The fact of the matter is that banks pay H-1b workers less because they can.

How funny is it that you call this measure a "populist" pandering tactic and Zac the writer of the article basically bashes it for supporting the elite at the expense of the tax paying populous. You take the exact opposite position and still find yourself in agreement, you guys are both idiots.

Zak,

Your post is arrogant and insulting, and I suspect you are not US born yourself...otherwise why are you so angry and defensive on this topic?

I am 100% in favor of the hire american first policy, it is only fair, and it is long overdue!

I have lived in many countries in the world, including countries that send many legal and illegal workers to the Unites States. The irony of those countries is that most would never allow me, an American, to work there, let alone take a high paying job from one of their residents. It wouldn't matter how qualified or intelligent I might be.

Foreigners have been spoiled by a very long US policy that was extremely relaxed. Those times are probably ending as soaring unemployment will awaken US citizens and lead them to demand more protection from their legislators. I expect most other countries to do the same. Perhaps when you lose your job to a foreigner getting paid 1/3 of your salary, you might begin to understand. Based on the comments to your post, I think you are outnumbered.

(btw, just try and get a job in China as an American, despite their booming economy)

Dave, Your comments are ill-informed, unthought and at best provincial.

Just look up the unemployment rate trends across years by educational attainment. (Let me know if you need help - I have a graph readily available).

On Citibank laying off 50,000 people its a non sequitur.

As for me being "I don't know which banks you have worked at and I doubt you have worked at any ... You are obviously commenting from a position of ignorance." Let me just say you are wrong - I know fully well and being thoughtful on what my comments are.

Your ignorance may be your bliss but is certainly society's bane.

Populism is great so let's push the envelope: let's ask all visa holders (of all type) in the USA to (a) pay 1.5 times taxes; (b) wear yellow robes around their neck ... just like what the Taliban wanted other religions to do in Afghanistan around 2000.

Wouldn't you agree?

" If the choice for a firm is to decide whether to outsource the work or not, the choice is clear: ship the jobs offshore and save $$."

no matter how many times that lie is repeated, it wont become true.

Indian outsourcers dominate the top 10 users of H-1b visas

The Indian Commerce Minister called H-1b 'The Outsourcing visa'

Many Indian Outsourcers state in their financial risks section of their SEC annual report section that H-1bs are CRITICALLY NECESSESARY for outsourcing

I know firsthand the problem we face is difficult to get our heads around.
I have been studying the problem from a Civil Rights perspective.

Relating to diversity, inclusiveness and Affirmative Action,
I urge you to read…
Who’s To Blame For The Affirmative Action Fiasco?
by Hugh Murray
http://www.barnesreview.org/html/affirmative__action.html

As you know, things are so bad that even the immigrants are complaining.
I have done some campaign work… knocking on doors for a local congressional
candidate and in doing so, Indians have invited me into their homes and
expressed their concerns… their biggest concern is more H-1bs.
See "Where Do APAs Stand On Affirmative Action? "
http://news.ncmonline.com/news/view_article.html?article_id=b8a8190cd75b1761095003b25bb49343

The purpose of Affirmative Action IS "To Ensure Equal
Employment Opportunity" to minorities and women
who may have been discriminated against in the past.

AA/EEO & NATIONAL ORIGIN DISCRIMINATION:
Affirmative Action was never intended to
be extended foreign workers who could not
possibly have ever been discriminated against
having never lived in this country before.

The EEOC and OFCCP has done next to nothing to protect individuals
whose National Origin is USA (nor green card holders).
Affirmative Action Plans and the EEO data collected intentionally
fail to collect data on National Origin to protect private sector
companies at the expense of US Citizens (and green card holders) middle class.
Ref.
http://www.eeoc.gov/eeo1survey

I am not a financial wizard, I have worked all my live and paid my taxes. That being said I believe all jobs should go American first. It appears to me that the mess our economy is in started with the huge outsourcing of jobs. The hell with Wal Mart and the nut job that runs it, he is un American and everyone should boycott Wal Mart, they sell junk made overseas at cheap prices. We have millions out of work because jobs have evaporated to China, Mexico, Canada and other sweat grinding, employer abusing countries. The only answer he has is shut America down and keep its people in low paying jobs! He needs to have his citizenship revoked. I have worked in the trades sector for a long time and I have seen the deteriotian of quality of the majority of products hit bottom. Buy a craftsman wrench it is warranted for life, if it breaks they replace it for free. Buy a wrench made in a foreign country and if it breaks try and return it. No I believe that either Mr Bissonette has alot of money tied up in overseas product companies, or he is just unAmerican! I would also like to point out that the countries industrial base is at its worst in years, the work force has dwindled we have been training our young kids for years to look for the fast easy money. Well that is what is happening and now this country is paying the price by jobs going overseas by the thousands. Like I said I am only a worker in the US trying to get along, I have always worked hard and paid my bills, I buy American because I want to see this country stay at the top.

It is sad that the reporter says Americans are lazy and underqualified. I would love to have him work next to me one day to really see how qualified he is to work. He probably never worked hard, held four jobs to keep his family fed, clothed and under a roof. Maybe he has forgotten all the breaks this country has given him, would he say the same if he was laid off and his job sent overseas for a supposed better qualified and harder worker. It is sad to see a person write such an article, but again if he is an American he must be one of those lazy, stupid, under achievers like he has written about in his article. The question is, why didn't he put himself in the same category as the rest of us? I guess he is better than all us dumb American workers, duh!

The reasoning for putting American workers to work is so that this country can maintain a level that it deserves. The people of this country deserve the support of our legislators and leaders, not foreigners that could care less what happens to the US. I agree with the majority and find no evidence that hiring Americans is a bad policy, it puts citizens to work, they spend money and they pay their taxes. It is not hard to understand that putting citizens to work and keeping as much of the money in the American worker will put money in the government where it is needed. Why does it not make sense to put 4 million citizens to work in this country it stimulates taxes and spending in the stores that are going bankrupt by the second, jobs lost means taxes not being paid, unemployment benefits being paid out by the millions.

Oh well, I guess we are just a bunch of stupid lazy Americans. I find that remark the most outrageous statement. Hey Zac stop calling us stupid and lazy. Time to grow up you ignorant panty waste.

Zac obviously is trying to stir up things for to get his name out there.

As a Tech worker how just lost his job along with several other highly qualified engineers, only to have other Engineers with visa get to stay on board makes no sense. Bottom line there is such thing as birth right and taking care of you own.
And what ever happened to applying to become a US citizen and getting a green card? I know engineers that went that route and gave up their homeland citizenship. I honor that action.

In the end I have seen visa holders end up going home anyways, basically the US becomes a training ground for them.
Tech guys like to say they just want more visas to retain graduate students, why not just encourage more US students to go into these critical fields and to go to grad school. Let capitalism take its course, if you offer more money to these jobs you will get more people moving that way.